Loved: "how different was the lectern from the stage?" -- I imagine you saying it with an Elizabethan flourish.
This is, as you maybe can imagine, an incredibly meaningful essay for me. I've down a lot of these same corridors and distilled similar conclusions. And now, after 20+ years as a (post-rocking) Social Studies soldier, last year my admin converted me into an English teacher. Independent Reading indeed!
Lots more to say, but mainly I'm grateful to have someone speak my experience, and so damn eloquently. And I would love to hire you as my edjamacation consultant!
Way to go Mr. Booth! SS is a blast, but English is the gas. I taught both so I entwined the two. I’ll bet you bring the Gene energy. It’s a lot of work though—so much to attend to in English.
The content of books, the social responses to your “brand,” maybe escape from lecture, are also extrinsic reinforcers—just not the crude carrot/stick type.
point taken. I see what you mean. That relates to a subsection of the class for sure. What led to the more intrinsic side of the ledger was my library where I made available books that were tailored to individual tastes, particularly boys who had no vision of themselves as readers, but responded to books that piqued their interest. And then there were the kids that just needed a jump start who read far beyond anyone's expectations, including their own.
yeah--that's excellent and I totally get your point as well.
It's just the terminology that trips me up. I think the whole "punished by rewards" thing blinds people to where reinforcement (behavior increasing consequences, by definition--not equivalent to "rewards" which are about intent of the giver) comes from. In behavior analysis we'd call the specific content of the book a "naturally occurring" reinforcer-- it's something that can maintain the behavior directly, as a product of doing the behavior. It makes more sense to me to say it's intrinsic/extrinsic to the activity of reading that book, rather than intrinsic/extrinsic to the student.
Providing books tailored to individual tastes is an absolutely beautiful and sensitive teaching arrangement that sets the reading behavior up to contact reinforcers (enjoyable stories, relevant or useful information, e.g.) that are likely to maintain the behavior of reading without the teacher contriving "rewards" like stickers that won't be there to support it later.
The problem for me is where "taste" becomes "intrinsic motivation" and the ultimate/most desirable cause of behavior. Why did I like Rush in high school? Was there something inherent in me (man I hope not), or was it associated with hanging out with my boyfriend and his friends, or with cool cars, which gave me something to talk to my dad about, or with science fiction/hobbit lit, which I read a lot of since my mom had it around and disapproved of stuff that was typically thought to be more "feminine," . . . this stuff magically becomes "intrinsic" to the person with the passage of time, the environmental influence becomes invisible, and then we lose important/useful info about why people do what they do.
Thanks for the discussion--I know it's a bit of a tangent. I am really enjoying your stories.
I read this before boarding a plane to England and had many thoughts that I wanted to write but traveling on the other side of the road has scrambled my head. I remember little of my response. Your Rush example illustrating how choice can still live under the extrinsic umbrella had me nodding, yup, hadn’t thought of it like that, and the lines do blur
Did you come across Frank Smith in your studies? The Art of Learning and Forgetting describes how we belong to “clubs”, as in I’m in the club of readers, the club of Rush fans, the club of skateboarders, its how you see yourself. It runs parallel to the intrinsic/extrinsic issue I guess.
What a great read! Thanks for sharing your Amazing Journey!
Loved: "how different was the lectern from the stage?" -- I imagine you saying it with an Elizabethan flourish.
This is, as you maybe can imagine, an incredibly meaningful essay for me. I've down a lot of these same corridors and distilled similar conclusions. And now, after 20+ years as a (post-rocking) Social Studies soldier, last year my admin converted me into an English teacher. Independent Reading indeed!
Lots more to say, but mainly I'm grateful to have someone speak my experience, and so damn eloquently. And I would love to hire you as my edjamacation consultant!
Way to go Mr. Booth! SS is a blast, but English is the gas. I taught both so I entwined the two. I’ll bet you bring the Gene energy. It’s a lot of work though—so much to attend to in English.
The content of books, the social responses to your “brand,” maybe escape from lecture, are also extrinsic reinforcers—just not the crude carrot/stick type.
point taken. I see what you mean. That relates to a subsection of the class for sure. What led to the more intrinsic side of the ledger was my library where I made available books that were tailored to individual tastes, particularly boys who had no vision of themselves as readers, but responded to books that piqued their interest. And then there were the kids that just needed a jump start who read far beyond anyone's expectations, including their own.
yeah--that's excellent and I totally get your point as well.
It's just the terminology that trips me up. I think the whole "punished by rewards" thing blinds people to where reinforcement (behavior increasing consequences, by definition--not equivalent to "rewards" which are about intent of the giver) comes from. In behavior analysis we'd call the specific content of the book a "naturally occurring" reinforcer-- it's something that can maintain the behavior directly, as a product of doing the behavior. It makes more sense to me to say it's intrinsic/extrinsic to the activity of reading that book, rather than intrinsic/extrinsic to the student.
Providing books tailored to individual tastes is an absolutely beautiful and sensitive teaching arrangement that sets the reading behavior up to contact reinforcers (enjoyable stories, relevant or useful information, e.g.) that are likely to maintain the behavior of reading without the teacher contriving "rewards" like stickers that won't be there to support it later.
The problem for me is where "taste" becomes "intrinsic motivation" and the ultimate/most desirable cause of behavior. Why did I like Rush in high school? Was there something inherent in me (man I hope not), or was it associated with hanging out with my boyfriend and his friends, or with cool cars, which gave me something to talk to my dad about, or with science fiction/hobbit lit, which I read a lot of since my mom had it around and disapproved of stuff that was typically thought to be more "feminine," . . . this stuff magically becomes "intrinsic" to the person with the passage of time, the environmental influence becomes invisible, and then we lose important/useful info about why people do what they do.
Thanks for the discussion--I know it's a bit of a tangent. I am really enjoying your stories.
I read this before boarding a plane to England and had many thoughts that I wanted to write but traveling on the other side of the road has scrambled my head. I remember little of my response. Your Rush example illustrating how choice can still live under the extrinsic umbrella had me nodding, yup, hadn’t thought of it like that, and the lines do blur
Did you come across Frank Smith in your studies? The Art of Learning and Forgetting describes how we belong to “clubs”, as in I’m in the club of readers, the club of Rush fans, the club of skateboarders, its how you see yourself. It runs parallel to the intrinsic/extrinsic issue I guess.
England, fun! I haven't read Smith but will look for it.